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that was house speaker john boehner today putting to rest the idea that a fiscal cliff deal is on its way. some angry lawmakers are now saying the last three weeks have been a complete waste and that president obama's new detailed proposal is a total non-starter. hedge fund manager jonathan hoenig agrees. he joins us to tell us why he thinks the president's plan rests entirely punishing the minority, that is the rich. thanks for having you back on the show. >> hello, melissa. melissa: this is depressing topic you will make it light and happy for us somehow. >> there is nothing happy about wealth destruction that is exactly what president is doing. you raised a very important point. why is it the president's plan to fix the economic calamity specifically reinvolves hurting minority, as you point out the so-called rich? redistribution is once again the center of his proposal. it is not only immoral but impractical as well. we're talking about 1.6 dro trillion coming out of the economy, coming out of invests, not being put into new jobs and new businesses being sent to washington instead
that was house speaker john boehner today putting to rest the idea that a fiscal cliff deal is on its way. some angry lawmakers are now saying the last three weeks have been a complete waste and that president obama's new detailed proposal is a total non-starter. hedge fund manager jonathan hoenig agrees. he joins us to tell us why he thinks the president's plan rests entirely punishing the minority, that is the rich. thanks for having you back on the show. >> hello, melissa. melissa:...
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lou: the staffs of both president obama and house speaker boehner are talking, but there is still no word of progress on the so-called fiscal cliff or the president's ultimatum. silence indicate a deal in the works or something too ugly for them to contemplate?@ we'll have the latest for you from the white house. white house correspondent ed henry here in just moments, but, first, the money line in hoping washington might get a deal done driving a modestly bullish mood on wall street at the end of the session. investors cheering news in a decline in jobless claims, and household wealth in the country grew by $1.7 trillion, to the highest level in five years, talk about a positive indicator for consumer purchasing. the dow jones industrial up 40 points, the s&p up five, and nasdaq rose 15.5 points. volume? a billion shares lighter than yesterday, but above the average of 3.1 billion trading on the board today. apple rebounded from yesterday's worst date performance in four years, a gain of $8.45 today with the ceo saying apple will move imac computer production to the country in the n
lou: the staffs of both president obama and house speaker boehner are talking, but there is still no word of progress on the so-called fiscal cliff or the president's ultimatum. silence indicate a deal in the works or something too ugly for them to contemplate?@ we'll have the latest for you from the white house. white house correspondent ed henry here in just moments, but, first, the money line in hoping washington might get a deal done driving a modestly bullish mood on wall street at the end...
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and president obama was progress. he was feeling more optimistic and he believes the speaker and the president are trading proposals right now. liz: ok, thank you very much. dave: the boosting gdp may be short-lived. we have someone who says call it for a slowdown in the u.s. and warning of a worldwide recession is sauce -- is the moderate thing to do. you don't want to miss harry dent coming. liz: drug refills may be costing you even more money this year filling brandname prescription. you know cheaper alternatives, they may be getting even more affordable. you got to hear this story. we take any kind of prescription drugs. details straight ahead in today's speed read. b you know how panful heartburn can be. for fast, long lasting relief, use doctor recoended gaviscon®. only gaviscon® forms a protective barrier that helps block stomach acid from splashing up- relievi the pain quickly. try fast, long lasting gaviscon®. maybe you want to incorporate a business. ortect your family with a will or living trust. and you
and president obama was progress. he was feeling more optimistic and he believes the speaker and the president are trading proposals right now. liz: ok, thank you very much. dave: the boosting gdp may be short-lived. we have someone who says call it for a slowdown in the u.s. and warning of a worldwide recession is sauce -- is the moderate thing to do. you don't want to miss harry dent coming. liz: drug refills may be costing you even more money this year filling brandname prescription. you...
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president obama and speaker john boehner actually talked to one another. it was on the telephone. it was not the face-to-face meeting the speaker says is necessary, but it was the first time that the two men have spoken in a week. for the latest on these stalled negotiations, we turn to fox news chief white house correspondent ed henry forhe report. >> trying to lay blame for stalled buet talks on republicans, president obama today wrateted up pressure on boehner. >> nobody wants this done more than me. >> for the first time, plan for massive spending cuts from going over the fiscal cff warning business executives, the economy could take another hit if republicans cide to extend just to middle class tax cuts to avoid the cliff for now and come back next year with more leverage to tie spending cuts and medicare reform to another hike in the nati's debt ceing. >> we're not going to play that game next year. if congress, in any way suggests they tie negotiations to debt ceiling votes, and take us to the ink of default again as part of a budget negotiation, i will not play that game.
president obama and speaker john boehner actually talked to one another. it was on the telephone. it was not the face-to-face meeting the speaker says is necessary, but it was the first time that the two men have spoken in a week. for the latest on these stalled negotiations, we turn to fox news chief white house correspondent ed henry forhe report. >> trying to lay blame for stalled buet talks on republicans, president obama today wrateted up pressure on boehner. >> nobody wants...
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peter: president obama and john boehner in front of cameras to make their cases in the battle over the fiscal cliff. the speaker said he is willing to move forward with negotiations in good faith after republicans rejected the president's first formal offer yesterday as being short on spending cuts, but it doesn't sound like anyone has put the brakes on the road to the coin. >> let's not kid ourselves. i am not trying to make this more difficult. i have been very guarded. i don't want to make it harder for me or the president or members of both parties to find common ground. >> this is not some run-of-the-mill debate, not about which political party can come out on top in negotiations and all of us get out of our comfort zones to make that happen. i am willing to do at and i am hopeful enough members of congress in both parties are willing to do that as well. >> the president's plan repeat his demand for $1.6 trillion over ten years on families making $250,000 a year and includes $400 billion in cuts, savings in medicare and medicaid and other entitlements over the same period. the pre
peter: president obama and john boehner in front of cameras to make their cases in the battle over the fiscal cliff. the speaker said he is willing to move forward with negotiations in good faith after republicans rejected the president's first formal offer yesterday as being short on spending cuts, but it doesn't sound like anyone has put the brakes on the road to the coin. >> let's not kid ourselves. i am not trying to make this more difficult. i have been very guarded. i don't want to...
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as soon as you see john boehner talk for obama it doesn't matter. the market seems to come off of that news. traders have got to look out if there's a joint announcement, chances are they're close to a deal, we will see the market higher. look out for that. dave: let's get off of stocks and deal with oil. we see oil slipping a bit and you see a point at which you might stop and that is $84.50. that is the point we have got to look at coming in next week as the starting point for this drop. phil: we have come down to that range several times over the last few weeks and that is when you had highest level supply out there and you didn't really have much geopolitical risk. we start to come back to that mode so we will scale back to that level before things heat up in the middle east and we have supply crunches due to the cold weather ahead of us. >> next week we have the final fit meeting of the year. the jobs report and everything we have been seeing. phil: we will see the fed continue on the same path of that they may just maturities they are going to
as soon as you see john boehner talk for obama it doesn't matter. the market seems to come off of that news. traders have got to look out if there's a joint announcement, chances are they're close to a deal, we will see the market higher. look out for that. dave: let's get off of stocks and deal with oil. we see oil slipping a bit and you see a point at which you might stop and that is $84.50. that is the point we have got to look at coming in next week as the starting point for this drop....
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and president obama keep saying the same thing. speaker boehner keeps asking for the same thing. we will be talking with one of more than 200 congressman who have signed the grover norquist antitax pledge. lou: congressional republicans pushing back hard against the president and democrats over the fiscalliff proposal. the white house saying that the real problem is republicans who won't give in on new taxes for top earners. my next guest sound grover norquist and his anti-tax pledge concerning. congressman nunes, it is great to have you with us. >> this little visit i timothy geithner to speaker boehner, in which he bsically says we are going to talk about stimulus -- that is pretty hard step to push or to stomachh isn't? >> yes, timothy geithner has been coming here for four years. he has come before the ways and means committee, before the budget committee. this guy has never told us the truth and we challenged them for years. the numbers don't add up, and that is the problem. he came here today and it was a waste of time. we shove the president meeting with the senate. it is
and president obama keep saying the same thing. speaker boehner keeps asking for the same thing. we will be talking with one of more than 200 congressman who have signed the grover norquist antitax pledge. lou: congressional republicans pushing back hard against the president and democrats over the fiscalliff proposal. the white house saying that the real problem is republicans who won't give in on new taxes for top earners. my next guest sound grover norquist and his anti-tax pledge...
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what i would like to hear is less out of boehner and less out of obama. if i hear that there has been a call made to representative boehner to come and speak in the white house that they will get something done. then i will start thinking about getting out. nothing until then. adam: some people say if we go over the cliff, it really is ... we still have a month or two for congress to fix things. >> if we go over the fiscal cliff, it will be bad. it will be really bad for the market. ultimately, it will make its way out. we are not solving this cliff before the end of the year. we have come to gather. we have a framework. we are here and they are there, but we will meet somewhere in the middle. i think it will be bad for the market if they work behind the curve. adam: when do they jump in if we go over the cliff? >> waited out. you will know. the first three days, at that point, start looking at getting into positions. our economy is doing better. things are pointing to growth. hopefully washington will not screw this up. if you look at these solid compani
what i would like to hear is less out of boehner and less out of obama. if i hear that there has been a call made to representative boehner to come and speak in the white house that they will get something done. then i will start thinking about getting out. nothing until then. adam: some people say if we go over the cliff, it really is ... we still have a month or two for congress to fix things. >> if we go over the fiscal cliff, it will be bad. it will be really bad for the market....
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and president obama keep saying the same thing. speaker boehner keeps asking for the same thing. we will be talking with one of more than 200 congressman who have signed the grover norquist antitax pledge. congressman nunes coming up next it [ male annouer ] if you're eligible for medicare, you may know it only covers about 80% of your part b medical expenses. u. is to me, relationships matter. i've been with my doctor for 12 years. now i know il be able to stick with him. [ male announcer ] with these types of plans, you'll be able to visit any doctor or hospital that accepts medicare patients. plus, there are no networks, and you never need a referral to see a specialist. so don't wait. call now and request this free decision guide to help you better understand medicare... and which aarp medicare supplement plan might be best for you. there's a wide range to choose from. we love to travel -- and there's so much more to see. so we found a plan that can travel with us. anywhere in the country. [ male announcer ] join the millions of people who have already enrolled in the only me
and president obama keep saying the same thing. speaker boehner keeps asking for the same thing. we will be talking with one of more than 200 congressman who have signed the grover norquist antitax pledge. congressman nunes coming up next it [ male annouer ] if you're eligible for medicare, you may know it only covers about 80% of your part b medical expenses. u. is to me, relationships matter. i've been with my doctor for 12 years. now i know il be able to stick with him. [ male announcer ]...
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. >> a house aide said president obama and house speaker john boehner spoke on3 the phone yesterday afternoon, their first conversation a week and since republicans offered $800 billion in new tax revenue and more than a trillion dollars in spending cuts, republicans say they're still waiting on a counter offer from the white house. lori: i wonder if they're talking football. >> it got messy. melissa: the house may be sending the members home t for e president seems to think if they got down to business, it is an easy fix. melissa: we can probably solve this in about a week. melissa: piece of cake. he thinks it is too late to get anything done before the end of the year as both sides are too far apart on key issues. joining us now, financial economist at jefferies. we think it is too late, we're going over the cliff. how come? >> not enough time to address all the issues that need to be addressed. especially they will talk o on a phone only once per week. it has been some progress on the tax cut side in terms of tax reform that could raise a type of revenue that we are going to need, but as f
. >> a house aide said president obama and house speaker john boehner spoke on3 the phone yesterday afternoon, their first conversation a week and since republicans offered $800 billion in new tax revenue and more than a trillion dollars in spending cuts, republicans say they're still waiting on a counter offer from the white house. lori: i wonder if they're talking football. >> it got messy. melissa: the house may be sending the members home t for e president seems to think if they...
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i don't get a sense from obama and boehner there is any compromise at this point. >> well, not now. this may be the week to shout at each other. maybe the it next two weeks are the weeks to get beyond shouting and come together. i think you're right on the dynamic. this in the end everybody seems to agree a deal with boehner. others are players. those are the two main players and they have to figure out how to get things done. tracy: like war of the roses. gerry seib, washington bureau chief of "the wall street journal." thank you, gerry. good stuff. >> thank you very much. ashley: coming up stunning new numbers where america's tax burden hits the hardest. liz macdonald will be here next with that story. tracy: ashley mentioned it earlier, drought conditions turning worse around the country. how will it impact your grocerisy bill if it isn't high enough? as we do every time this time of day see how oil is trading. up slightly. $88.91 a barrel. we'll be right back tracy: so president obama continuing to push tax hikes on the rich as part of the big fiscal cliff deal but will raising
i don't get a sense from obama and boehner there is any compromise at this point. >> well, not now. this may be the week to shout at each other. maybe the it next two weeks are the weeks to get beyond shouting and come together. i think you're right on the dynamic. this in the end everybody seems to agree a deal with boehner. others are players. those are the two main players and they have to figure out how to get things done. tracy: like war of the roses. gerry seib, washington bureau...
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john boehner had with president obama last night so john boehner came out to give us a report on this and he said in his view there has been, quote, no substantive progress in talks to avert a fiscal cliff in the last two weeks. take a listen. >> this is not a game. jobs are on the line. the american economy is on the line and this is a moment for adult leadership. campaign style rallies and that is not a way to get things done in washington. peter: republicans want to hear concrete solid major proposals from the white house on spending cuts and entitlement reform. right now tim geithner is meeting with senate republican leader mitch mccoll was a key player in this, meeting at 1:00 or so with house democrattc leader nancy pelosi in the earlier first this morning with senate democratic leader harry reid. cheryl: a busy day before the treasury secretary monitoring his movements. dennis: what is the next step in the fiscal cliff talks? 30 days left to negotiate. more posturing ahead? more progress? the senior editor at fortune magazine predicts, i remember the moment in the presidential
john boehner had with president obama last night so john boehner came out to give us a report on this and he said in his view there has been, quote, no substantive progress in talks to avert a fiscal cliff in the last two weeks. take a listen. >> this is not a game. jobs are on the line. the american economy is on the line and this is a moment for adult leadership. campaign style rallies and that is not a way to get things done in washington. peter: republicans want to hear concrete solid...
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connell: if i had to make a prediction, it is in both interest of speaker boehner and president obama to come up with a solution. they will both be remembered not necessarily for january, february, arch of next year, but held the second term when. it is always tough. >> it sure does not help to start out with your first year of your second term with the economy back in recession. i think we will get a deal. we cannot get the compromise on the really big issues like bono commented. i think we will not fall over the cliff. it will be 150-175. that will take a bite out of consumer spending, ap in the first quarter. we will have a decent holiday sale. some pay back early next year. connell: thank you, stuart. i think you bring up an important point. even if we solve this, you will see higher taxes lower spending. some tough news from microsoft that came out today. the company will cut its order of the new surface tablet that we have talked about from 4 million units to 2 million units. this is all because of weak demand. it runs on a result eight. they continue to see very weak demand for
connell: if i had to make a prediction, it is in both interest of speaker boehner and president obama to come up with a solution. they will both be remembered not necessarily for january, february, arch of next year, but held the second term when. it is always tough. >> it sure does not help to start out with your first year of your second term with the economy back in recession. i think we will get a deal. we cannot get the compromise on the really big issues like bono commented. i think...
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president obama wants those tax rates raised. john boehner, he wants fewer deductions, limits on deductions. that's the status quo right now of the discussion there. i want to bring you to the big board because we're going nowhere this tuesday morning on very low volume. back below 13,000. tuesday morning, here's the company: elizabeth macdonald is with us. david asman is with us. and nicole petallides right there on the floor of the new york stock exchange. china, cracking down on money transfers at wynn macau casinos. i guess that wynn stock is going to be down? nicole: you are right. we're seeing the stock down nearly 4% here. this is not good news for them overall. basically china's new leadership cracking down on fast money moving. they are going to set rules where you can't -- restrict the limits on how much money can actually be taken out of the country. there are a lot of new rules that would be put in place. all of it is obviously for responsible gambling, but it seems to be a lot deeper than that. stuart: i've been to t
president obama wants those tax rates raised. john boehner, he wants fewer deductions, limits on deductions. that's the status quo right now of the discussion there. i want to bring you to the big board because we're going nowhere this tuesday morning on very low volume. back below 13,000. tuesday morning, here's the company: elizabeth macdonald is with us. david asman is with us. and nicole petallides right there on the floor of the new york stock exchange. china, cracking down on money...
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house speaker boehner had a conversation last night with president obama about 15 minutes long. he met with treasury secretary geithner came out this morning and came out with a press conference and said the two sides made quote, no substantive progress toward a deal to avert the fiscal cliff. speaker boehner said republicans put revenue on the table but the president and democrats haven't put enough on the table about spending cuts and are not serious about spending cuts. it is democrats are not serious about tax revenues. still one top democrat said, don't listen to the rhetoric. >> going over the fiscal cliff is serious business and i'm here seriously trying to resolve it and i would hope the white house would get serious as well. >> speaker boehner this morning ssys there is no progress all you have to do is just listen to what's happening out there and you know there is progress? >> speaker boehner in his press conference said, quote, this is a moment for adult, for some adult leadership. kind of a slap at the president there, ashley. ashley: boy oh, boy. the rhetoric start
house speaker boehner had a conversation last night with president obama about 15 minutes long. he met with treasury secretary geithner came out this morning and came out with a press conference and said the two sides made quote, no substantive progress toward a deal to avert the fiscal cliff. speaker boehner said republicans put revenue on the table but the president and democrats haven't put enough on the table about spending cuts and are not serious about spending cuts. it is democrats are...
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. >> boehner's surprise is in part because this is a different obama he is now negotiating with. and it is not just that obama won an election. he has often compromised on his own. he has offered plans that tracked where he thought the final compromise would end up. the white house figured that by being list is us to they would win goodwill own the other side and even if they didn't, the media would come to their side realizing they sought compromise in the same place and been rebuffed by republicans. the white house does not believe that any more. probably the key lesson they took from the last couple of years is this. do not negotiate with yourself. if republicans want it cut medicare, let them propose the cuts. if they want it raise revenue through tax reform as opposed to marginal rates, let them tell you with what they want it eliminate. if they want deeper cuts to discretionary spending, let them give you a number. above all, if they don't like your policies, let them propose their own. that way if the white house does give in to hire demands, the republicans would feel lik
. >> boehner's surprise is in part because this is a different obama he is now negotiating with. and it is not just that obama won an election. he has often compromised on his own. he has offered plans that tracked where he thought the final compromise would end up. the white house figured that by being list is us to they would win goodwill own the other side and even if they didn't, the media would come to their side realizing they sought compromise in the same place and been rebuffed by...
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. >> there is movement on these talks and president obama and john boehner spoke on the phone days after republicans offered a hundred billion dollars of tax revenue. republicans say they're waiting on a counteroffer from the white house. back to you. dennis: should republicans hold out and let us go over the fiscal click? john brown of euro pacific capital is with us and former adviser to british prime minister margaret thatcher and he joins us with his take. thanks for being with us. do you think we are going over the cliff? >> cliff of sorts. the fiscal cliff was created by politicians who lack the courage to do the best for the american people. and already has done severe damage to the economy. now we have democrats who want to suck money out of the economy in tax and we have rhino republicans in name only who wants spending cuts. both those things will do damag% to the economy and any compromise will damage the economy and push it further into deep recession. neither side discusses the real problem which is the enormous costs of big government. cost in money and regulations and intr
. >> there is movement on these talks and president obama and john boehner spoke on the phone days after republicans offered a hundred billion dollars of tax revenue. republicans say they're waiting on a counteroffer from the white house. back to you. dennis: should republicans hold out and let us go over the fiscal click? john brown of euro pacific capital is with us and former adviser to british prime minister margaret thatcher and he joins us with his take. thanks for being with us. do...
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you've got a existed in in president obama versus a lose her in john boehner. and here is boehner again yesterday, on fox news sunday saying, when he looked at the president's proposal, oh my god. >> i was flabbergasted. >> flabbergasted. >> he can't be serious. i just have never seen anything like it. we've got seven weeks between election day and the end of the year three weeks have been wasted with the nonsense. who is flabbergasted anymore? have you ever heard that word? >> peter: an old word. >> 1920s called. they weren't there. >> bill: yeah, my great aunt madeline used to say, "flabbergasted" she was 90 then. >> i was waiting for him to say we got beat, it was a slobberknocker. >> maybe they say that in the bar. the other thing is t flabbergasted? he has known about this plan. you can check it out. this is nothing to be flabbergasted about. this was out there long since the election and ever since. >> a non--serious proposal. the president was asking for $1.6 trillion worth of new revenue over 10 years, twice as much aziz been asking for in public. stimu
you've got a existed in in president obama versus a lose her in john boehner. and here is boehner again yesterday, on fox news sunday saying, when he looked at the president's proposal, oh my god. >> i was flabbergasted. >> flabbergasted. >> he can't be serious. i just have never seen anything like it. we've got seven weeks between election day and the end of the year three weeks have been wasted with the nonsense. who is flabbergasted anymore? have you ever heard that word?...
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obama to come up with a new proposal. vice president joe biden says a deal could be done in 15 minutes. all this comes as the government announces a gain of 146,000 jobs in the month of november. the unemployment rate fell to 7.7%. that is the lowest in four years but that was mostly due to people who stopped looking for work. both sides agree the u.s. does not want to follow down the path of greece. what is to blame there? too much austerity or too much taxation? we'll look at the problems inside his own party, for speaker boehner. it's friday. that means the lightning round with the panel. "special report" from washington starts at 6:00 eastern. now back to new york and "the five." ♪ ♪ >> bob: kay. there is music for you. on december 3 last year, 16-year-old tyler alfred from oklahoma was driving under the influence and crashed his pickup truck killing his passenger and friend 16-year-old john luke. he pleaded guilty to first degree man slaughter in august. in the muskogee county -- it's oklahoma, district judge mik
obama to come up with a new proposal. vice president joe biden says a deal could be done in 15 minutes. all this comes as the government announces a gain of 146,000 jobs in the month of november. the unemployment rate fell to 7.7%. that is the lowest in four years but that was mostly due to people who stopped looking for work. both sides agree the u.s. does not want to follow down the path of greece. what is to blame there? too much austerity or too much taxation? we'll look at the problems...
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he said basically exactly what president obama just said and he then expanded on his comments instead of denying them or refusing to comment at all, which he could have done. house speaker john boehner, who needs other loyal republicans to start talking sense to crazy tea par party, he was outraged by his suggestion. >> you're not going to grow the economy if you raise tax rates on the top two rates. we're willing to put revenue on the table as long as we're not raising rates. >> but that didn't stop congressman cole from going on hardball today continuing to sell the idea of making peace with the president for the sake of 98% of american taxpayers. >> if the president's willing to accept 80% of the bush tax cuts for 98% of the american people and make them permanent, i think that is a point we should agree op. >> tom cole also made it clear he is still a boehner loyalist. >> i fully support him. what he's trying to achieve, which is no rate increase, but try and meet the president partway on revenue. i support that. i suspect he'll negotiate a good deal. at the end of the day, he'll
he said basically exactly what president obama just said and he then expanded on his comments instead of denying them or refusing to comment at all, which he could have done. house speaker john boehner, who needs other loyal republicans to start talking sense to crazy tea par party, he was outraged by his suggestion. >> you're not going to grow the economy if you raise tax rates on the top two rates. we're willing to put revenue on the table as long as we're not raising rates. >>...
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boehner and obama have met before. the summer of 2011. they put a lot of specifics on paper. when boehner coudn g backing from his conference. >> how close is this toth i didn't see this in advance. this was reallyop b. th tn goatn.3 > dl nde. s >> there has been progress. >> right now i would say we're nowhere.3 irey ssisc. paul begala, david frum, former adviser to president george w. bush. gentlemen, nice to have you both. david, let's start with you. depending on who you listen to, it's either going great or not going well at all. they're either optimistic or completely pessimistic. which is it? >> i feel about this whole process as a basketball nonfan, i feel about basketball, which is start it 100-100 and play for five minutes to get it over with. but i think we also need to take a step back and realize just how lunatic this whole process is. what the united states does not need right now is either spending cuts or tax increases. what we should be thinking about is how to get growth. instead of the mishandling of the deal in 2011, we have to pretend that we have what is
boehner and obama have met before. the summer of 2011. they put a lot of specifics on paper. when boehner coudn g backing from his conference. >> how close is this toth i didn't see this in advance. this was reallyop b. th tn goatn.3 > dl nde. s >> there has been progress. >> right now i would say we're nowhere.3 irey ssisc. paul begala, david frum, former adviser to president george w. bush. gentlemen, nice to have you both. david, let's start with you. depending on who...
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boehner and obama have met before. the summer of 2011. they put a lot of specifics on paper. when boehner couldn't get backing. >> how close is this to that is this. >> it is a broad outline, but there is a lot of negotiation. even members of the congress didn't see this in advance. this was really an opening bid. it is best seen as really a response to pressure. but people saying where's our plan. you've got to put a plan out there to begin the negotiation. >> thank you. >>> deal or no deal. we're on the edge of our seats. 29 days in counting until our taxes go up and across the board spending cuts. we're getting lots of mixed messages as to what's going to happen and where things stand. >> i'm increasingly pessimistic. >> so tonight, two men who have lots of experience dealing with lawmakers. paul begala, david frum, former adviser to president george w. bush. david, let's start with you. >> i feel about this whole process as a basketball nonfan, i feel about basketball, which is start it 100-100 and play for five minutes to get it overwith. but i think we also need to take
boehner and obama have met before. the summer of 2011. they put a lot of specifics on paper. when boehner couldn't get backing. >> how close is this to that is this. >> it is a broad outline, but there is a lot of negotiation. even members of the congress didn't see this in advance. this was really an opening bid. it is best seen as really a response to pressure. but people saying where's our plan. you've got to put a plan out there to begin the negotiation. >> thank you....
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. >> speaker boehner's counter offer yesterday to president obama which included a mythical increase in tax revenue of $800 billion obtained by reducing or eliminating unspecified tax deductions was taken seriously by no one in the senate except republican jim demipt. speaker boehner's $800 billion tax hike will destroy american jobs. the heritage foundation skewered the boehner counteroffer on its blog. at first blush, it appears little more than categorical preemptive capitulation. to be fair, the details of the republican proposal are extraordinarily vague to the extent it can be interpreted from the hazy details that it is utterly unacceptable. president obama said today there is a time and a place to discuss reforming the tax code. but that time is not now. >> what i've suggested is let's put a down payment on taxes, let's let tax rates on the upper income folks go up. let's let those go up. and then let's set up a process with a time certain at the end of 2013 or the fall of 2013 where we work on tax reform. we look at what loopholes and deductions both democrats and republican
. >> speaker boehner's counter offer yesterday to president obama which included a mythical increase in tax revenue of $800 billion obtained by reducing or eliminating unspecified tax deductions was taken seriously by no one in the senate except republican jim demipt. speaker boehner's $800 billion tax hike will destroy american jobs. the heritage foundation skewered the boehner counteroffer on its blog. at first blush, it appears little more than categorical preemptive capitulation. to...
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his plan for bringing down the deficit, which got nothing from boehner. i like the way you are putting this. in the first term, it seemed to me that obama was very conciliatory towards republicans. he wanted to create a grand one and he learned something in his first term. for right now, he is offering them nothing. see how you like it. we tried it the other way for four years. i've gotten nothing back in return but blockage. let's try it this way and see how it goes. >> it suggests the possibility of political cover, that he makes the big offer. if this is not the godfather, if this is a used car negotiation, he is low-balling but giving plenty of cover. they get to say 1 trillion attacks as the increase. is it really an offer for nothing or is it that much more political cover that he is offering? >> i think it is more political cover. if you look at the contrast with 2010. they were in a different situation. in 2010, there were things that obama needed. he had a re-election coming up. he also wanted that big payroll tax which was essentially stimulus.
his plan for bringing down the deficit, which got nothing from boehner. i like the way you are putting this. in the first term, it seemed to me that obama was very conciliatory towards republicans. he wanted to create a grand one and he learned something in his first term. for right now, he is offering them nothing. see how you like it. we tried it the other way for four years. i've gotten nothing back in return but blockage. let's try it this way and see how it goes. >> it suggests the...
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president obama and house speaker john boehner finally on speaking terms. but the question is are they speaking each other's language yet when it comes to the fiscal cliff? with just 26 days to go before the country officially goes over the edge, there are reports a growing course of republicans are pressuring house leaders to cave on tax hikes for the wealthy, this following president obama and speaker boehner's first phone call in days with both sides staying mum on the details. this afternoon president obama's fiscal photo-op off the day takes him to the suburban home of a middle class families in virginia, one of the thousands who responded to the
president obama and house speaker john boehner finally on speaking terms. but the question is are they speaking each other's language yet when it comes to the fiscal cliff? with just 26 days to go before the country officially goes over the edge, there are reports a growing course of republicans are pressuring house leaders to cave on tax hikes for the wealthy, this following president obama and speaker boehner's first phone call in days with both sides staying mum on the details. this...
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. >> let's listen to another thing grover said yesterday about president obama. >> it's the president who is threatening to raise taxes on the middle class if he doesn't stamp his feet and get his way. >> it's so funny to see somebody talk about someone else in full projection mode. >> right. >> that is grover. you know, stomping his feet and getting his way and he's pretending that the president debafs the way he does. >> that's been his entire path to power and he has gotten his way because not only has he stamped his feet to get his way but he's also threatened people. he's done that here by saying that the tea party 2 is going to dwarf tea party 1, that's sending out a message saying, if you support any revenue increases, if you go along with compromise, we're going to get you next time around in your primary. that's what this is all about. it's an intimidation to republicans thinking about actually trying to come to some sort of deal and move forward. >> let's listen to a prediction that lindsey graham made which i think i agree with. >> i think we're going over the cliff. it's p
. >> let's listen to another thing grover said yesterday about president obama. >> it's the president who is threatening to raise taxes on the middle class if he doesn't stamp his feet and get his way. >> it's so funny to see somebody talk about someone else in full projection mode. >> right. >> that is grover. you know, stomping his feet and getting his way and he's pretending that the president debafs the way he does. >> that's been his entire path to power...
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president obama and house speaker john boehner finally on speaking terms. but the question is are they speaking each other's language yet when it comes to the fiscal cliff? with just 26 days to go before the country officially goes over the edge, there are reports a growing course of republicans are pressuring house leaders to cave on tax hikes for the wealthy, this following president obama and speaker boehner's first phone
president obama and house speaker john boehner finally on speaking terms. but the question is are they speaking each other's language yet when it comes to the fiscal cliff? with just 26 days to go before the country officially goes over the edge, there are reports a growing course of republicans are pressuring house leaders to cave on tax hikes for the wealthy, this following president obama and speaker boehner's first phone
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i don't think either of these men, president obama or john boehner, want to see this country go off the fiscal cliff. there's obviously too much at stake not only politically but for the lives and welfare of americans. i think that's foremost in their mind, even given all the politics. so thelma and louise, whatever conspiracy theories we see right now, they might be justified because we're at a standoff at least publicly right now as we head into december, alex. >> mike viqueira at the white house, thanks for that. >>> joining me for more front page politics, perry bacon junior and political contributor for the "washington post." perry, the president's plan is pretty ambitious. what is the strategy here? >> the strategy is to move this debate to the left. i mean, a lot of times you saw in these first four years obama would kind of start in the center on a plan and then the republicans could move to the right a little bit. in this plan, obama knows republicans don't support stimulus money. they don't support $1.6 trillion in taxes. he's saying i won the election. we're going to start wi
i don't think either of these men, president obama or john boehner, want to see this country go off the fiscal cliff. there's obviously too much at stake not only politically but for the lives and welfare of americans. i think that's foremost in their mind, even given all the politics. so thelma and louise, whatever conspiracy theories we see right now, they might be justified because we're at a standoff at least publicly right now as we head into december, alex. >> mike viqueira at the...
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obama under the white house proposal. the president would have the power to raise the debt limit on his own, whenever he wants, as needed. speaker boehner saying congress isn't budging on that issue and here is what he had to say on fox news sunday. >> congress will never give up the power and i made it clear to the president that when we get to the debt limit we need to cut some reforms that are greater than the increase in the debt limit. it is the only way to leverage the political process to produce more change than if left alone. >>gregg: you can see more of the remarks on "fox news sunday" at the top of the hour. >> extreme weather on the west coast flood advisories in effect for storm ravaged parts of northern california as another storm bringing heavy rain and police and fire officials wanting the napa and russian rivers expected to break their banks. and now, streaming live from northern california. >>reporter: yes, the banks are about to break any moment now, 12 hours ago there was torrential rain it looked to b
obama under the white house proposal. the president would have the power to raise the debt limit on his own, whenever he wants, as needed. speaker boehner saying congress isn't budging on that issue and here is what he had to say on fox news sunday. >> congress will never give up the power and i made it clear to the president that when we get to the debt limit we need to cut some reforms that are greater than the increase in the debt limit. it is the only way to leverage the political...
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either obama's table or boehner's and you talk straight. >> bill: at the table they're both there and they don't get to go to the bathroom until they get something. >> it's going to be a little faster negotiation than i thought. can we call it with that one addendum the dobbs reilly plan will be. >> bill: will be o'reilly. >> o'reilly dobz plan. -- dobbs plan. >> bill: fox business network dobbs reilly and fnc dobbs o'reilly. >> i will take it. >> bill: we can work it out. >> here it is. >> bill: all right. next on the rub down, the factor in the middle of the culture war over christmas. we'll have an update. later some harvard students have started a bondage club and they want the university to pay for it. why not? might be sadistic. coming right back. >> bill: facing to follow up segment tonight, new rasmussen survey released this week says 68% of american adults prefer the greeting merry christmas this time of year. just 23% like happy holidays. michigan federal appeals court has reversed decision that banned nativity display folks in warrant, michigan put up a crest. atheists comp
either obama's table or boehner's and you talk straight. >> bill: at the table they're both there and they don't get to go to the bathroom until they get something. >> it's going to be a little faster negotiation than i thought. can we call it with that one addendum the dobbs reilly plan will be. >> bill: will be o'reilly. >> o'reilly dobz plan. -- dobbs plan. >> bill: fox business network dobbs reilly and fnc dobbs o'reilly. >> i will take it. >> bill:...
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president obama has new words of speaker boehner and the republicans in his first tv interview since the election and since the fiscal cliff stalemate started. no deal until republicans drop the opposition to raising tax rates on the wealthy. that's the president's message. we'll play the interview for you, parts of it, and also hear from democratic congressman adam schiff. from the president shooting down speaker boehner proposal to now conservative groups going aafter him, who are boehner's allies at this point. where is governor jan brewer. the mystery about the out of state business trip and why his own spokesperson says he can't disclose where she is. bp has paid over twenty-three billion dollars to help those affected and to cover cleanup costs. today, the beaches and gulf are open, and many areas are reporting their best tourism seasons in years. and bp's also committed to america. we support nearly 250,000 jobs and invest more here than anywhere else. we're working to fuel america for generations to come. our commitment has never been stronger. now we need a little bit more..
president obama has new words of speaker boehner and the republicans in his first tv interview since the election and since the fiscal cliff stalemate started. no deal until republicans drop the opposition to raising tax rates on the wealthy. that's the president's message. we'll play the interview for you, parts of it, and also hear from democratic congressman adam schiff. from the president shooting down speaker boehner proposal to now conservative groups going aafter him, who are boehner's...
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either obama's table or boehner's and you talk straight. >> bill: at the table they're both there and they don't get to go to the bathroom until they get something. >> it's going to be a little faster negotiation than i thought. can we call it with that one addendum the dobbs reilly plan will be. >> bill: will be o'reilly. >> o'reilly dobz plan. -- dobbs plan. >> bill: fox business network dobbs reilly and fnc dobbs o'reilly. >> i will take it. >> bill: we can work it out. >> here it is. >> bill: all right. next on the rub down, the factor in the middle of the culture war over christmas. we'll have an update. later some harvard students have started a bondage club and they want the university to pay for it. why not? might be sadistic. coming right back. [ male announcer ] we all make bad decisions. like say, gas station sushi. cheap is good. and sushi, good. but cheap sushi, not so good. it's like that super-low rate on not enough car insurance. pretty sketchy. ♪ and then there are the good decisions. like esurance. their coverage counselor tool helps you choose the right coverage f
either obama's table or boehner's and you talk straight. >> bill: at the table they're both there and they don't get to go to the bathroom until they get something. >> it's going to be a little faster negotiation than i thought. can we call it with that one addendum the dobbs reilly plan will be. >> bill: will be o'reilly. >> o'reilly dobz plan. -- dobbs plan. >> bill: fox business network dobbs reilly and fnc dobbs o'reilly. >> i will take it. >> bill:...
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this deal will only get done by president obama and john boehner making a deal. they came close in the summer of 2011. the parties are so polarized and partisans polarized this is a problem. >> i keep saying we need a presidential historian or hostage negotiator. somebody could say we've been at stalemates before, gotten over it, shut down the government in '96. tip o'neill and ronald reagan managed to solve problems and get along. listen to what john mccain said about what we need here. >> it's time now to sit across the table from one another, rather than -- in the way they did with ronald reagan and the way you get things done in washington. >> the way they did with ronald reagan and get things done in washington. you sit together and figure it out. they were at a holiday party they didn't talk to each other. they're issuing sort of statements and rebuttals and saying i'm not going to budge. >> negotiation by press release. this is not how things get done in washington and part of the problem of the growing incivility in washington. people don't work together
this deal will only get done by president obama and john boehner making a deal. they came close in the summer of 2011. the parties are so polarized and partisans polarized this is a problem. >> i keep saying we need a presidential historian or hostage negotiator. somebody could say we've been at stalemates before, gotten over it, shut down the government in '96. tip o'neill and ronald reagan managed to solve problems and get along. listen to what john mccain said about what we need here....
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for what it's worth, president obama and house speaker boehner are talking. they had a nice telephone conversation. that's terrific. the first time in a week but apparently that's the headline. that's the editorial body. not much came out of it that we know of. sources say no real breakthrough. no formal negotiations. sessions are not scheduled. no back channel discussions taking place that anybody knows about at this time and as we wait for the white house briefing to begin, let's bring in wolf blitzer on this topic. there are a couple of polls that are very telling about how americans feel about congress and the president are behaving when it comes to the fiscal cliff. let me read some of these numbers for you. should obama compromise to get things done. 72% say yes. 22% say no. should the gop compromise to get things done. and take a look. 72% say yes. my question for you, wolf, i'm not sure you'll have the answer but perhaps you'll have guidance. for those democrats who say the president has a mandate because voters voted him into office while he campaign
for what it's worth, president obama and house speaker boehner are talking. they had a nice telephone conversation. that's terrific. the first time in a week but apparently that's the headline. that's the editorial body. not much came out of it that we know of. sources say no real breakthrough. no formal negotiations. sessions are not scheduled. no back channel discussions taking place that anybody knows about at this time and as we wait for the white house briefing to begin, let's bring in...
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first, president obama speaks in pennsylvania, followed by john boehner responded to the president from capitol hill. then eric cantor response of the lighthouse deficit reduction package. later, nancy pelosi addresses the fiscal cliff and middle- class tax cuts. president obama talked about the so-called fiscal cliff and his proposal to end of the bush tax cuts on those earning more than two and a $50,000. ed -- more than $250,000. ["hail to the chief" plays] please have a seat. have a seat. relax for a second. it is good to see all of you. hello. it is good to be back in pennsylvania. it is good to be right here. i want to thank michael, robert, and the investor, joel glickman for hosting me today and giving me a great tour. stand up so everybody can see you, guys. [cheers and applause] there you go. we have a couple of outstanding members of congress here. [cheers and applause] now, i just finished getting a tour of the workshop. i have to say it makes me wish that joel invented this stuff sooner when i was a kid. back then, you couldn't build a roller coaster out of your erector set
first, president obama speaks in pennsylvania, followed by john boehner responded to the president from capitol hill. then eric cantor response of the lighthouse deficit reduction package. later, nancy pelosi addresses the fiscal cliff and middle- class tax cuts. president obama talked about the so-called fiscal cliff and his proposal to end of the bush tax cuts on those earning more than two and a $50,000. ed -- more than $250,000. ["hail to the chief" plays] please have a seat. have...
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i think john boehner has to go back to his members and say look, president obama won the election, polling suggests we republicans lose if we go over the cliff, and i got this one thing that's going to mitigate your unhappiness over the fact that we're moving up rates on the wealthiest americans. he needs the third part to sell the whole package. >> and david, there is a jobs report today which sort of mixed news for everyone. it's a good number, down to 7.7%, unemployment, 146,000 new jobs added but the downside is that fewer people were in the labor force a lot fewer, because people gave up on even trying. >> i think this is one of the more provocative questions and get to it on sunday, which is, are we too focused on the debt. are we not focused enough on what the government can be doing to try to spur job growth? beyond just -- >> there was a stimulus piece in the offer from the white house that was laughed at by the -- >> laughed at but could end up surviving. one of the things about the president's initial offer is it may have sent a bad signal to conservatives but it did have the ef
i think john boehner has to go back to his members and say look, president obama won the election, polling suggests we republicans lose if we go over the cliff, and i got this one thing that's going to mitigate your unhappiness over the fact that we're moving up rates on the wealthiest americans. he needs the third part to sell the whole package. >> and david, there is a jobs report today which sort of mixed news for everyone. it's a good number, down to 7.7%, unemployment, 146,000 new...
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but late today speaker boehner and president obama did speak to one another on the phone. now, this is an important development because it's the first time they've talked in a week about the fiscal cliff. i am told, though, that there was no real progress in negotiations. in this sense there was no breakthrough on that central point of tax rates. as you know, president obama insists there is no deal unless the gop agrees to raise rates on the top 2% of earners. the gop says that's a nonstarter. and the two men have not moved from that basic position. now, all of this comes at the same time treasury secretary geithner also said for the first time the administration would be willing to go over the fiscal cliff if the gop does not agree to raise those rates. this was treasury secretary geithner earlier today on cnbc. >> is the administration prepared to go over the fiscal cliff? >> oh, absolutely. there's no prospect to an agreement that doesn't involve those rates going up on the top 2% of the wealthiest. remember, it's only 2%. all those americans, too, get a tax cut on the
but late today speaker boehner and president obama did speak to one another on the phone. now, this is an important development because it's the first time they've talked in a week about the fiscal cliff. i am told, though, that there was no real progress in negotiations. in this sense there was no breakthrough on that central point of tax rates. as you know, president obama insists there is no deal unless the gop agrees to raise rates on the top 2% of earners. the gop says that's a nonstarter....
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obama has the advantage of letting--going over the cliff and letting it all expire so he starts to get the revenue that he wants. what does boehner have to negotiate? j. >> cenk: this is dr. strangelove territory. this is peter sellers pushing the button. you do this, and you destroy yourself. it's an insane negotiating ploy. it's hard to think that he could push that button. he used it last year and there was a consensus that politically that republicans lost face and lost public support and they were playing with fire. am i misreading this? >> no, because i think part of it, again, we're talking about the markets. it strikes fear in the markets. they say, president obama you better do something because the stock markets and the bond markets are reacting negatively to all these issues about the debt ceiling. but we saw what happened after august of 2011 we got downgraded. our debt was downgraded but the interest rates that we pay on our debt has fallen. the stock market has continued to rise. i think if we had that drama again, the treasury department has options. there is a constitut
obama has the advantage of letting--going over the cliff and letting it all expire so he starts to get the revenue that he wants. what does boehner have to negotiate? j. >> cenk: this is dr. strangelove territory. this is peter sellers pushing the button. you do this, and you destroy yourself. it's an insane negotiating ploy. it's hard to think that he could push that button. he used it last year and there was a consensus that politically that republicans lost face and lost public support...
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what does president obama think of speaker boehner's proposal to avert the fiscal cliff? >> unfortunately, the speaker's proposal right now is still out of balance. he talks about $800 billion worth of revenues but says he's going to do that by lowering rates. when you look at the math, it doesn't work. >> reporter: he won't agree to eliminate a tax deduction for contributions to charity. >> every hospital and university and nonfor profit agency across the country would find themselves on the verge of collapse. so that's not a realistic option. >> reporter: but the president didn't say all this to speaker boehner. he said it in an interview on bloomberg tv. the last time the two men spoke was almost a week ago. president obama is focused on the stalemate with congress over averting the fiscal cliff, but he's just not talking to house republicans about it. at the white house, he discussed the issue with a bipartisan group of governors. >> i know that the president wants a deal and he didn't try to handicap it. >> reporter: earlier this week, he told so-called middle class
what does president obama think of speaker boehner's proposal to avert the fiscal cliff? >> unfortunately, the speaker's proposal right now is still out of balance. he talks about $800 billion worth of revenues but says he's going to do that by lowering rates. when you look at the math, it doesn't work. >> reporter: he won't agree to eliminate a tax deduction for contributions to charity. >> every hospital and university and nonfor profit agency across the country would find...
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i'm wondering if john boehner and barack obama got together, had their short conversation and say hey, why don't we characterize this as a curt, short, curt conversation. that will help you with your people. that will help -- didn't you love that? you know, we hear they talked, and they had a curt conversation. >> reporter: yeah. there is truth to that. >> exactly what both sides wanted to hear. >> reporter: no, there is truth to that. look, the white house is well aware that they can't -- you know, the one reason why there's not meetings here? that's bad for boehner. boehner can't be seen here on, quote, enemy territory cutting the deal. right? it has -- i mean, look. the semantics matter. you hate to admit that it does, but it does. and the settings matter. that's why you're not seeing a lot of meetings here. >> it does and there are a lot of republicans -- remember newt gingrich going over to the white house through the budget negotiations in the 1990s, and newt gingrich's own words getting his pockets picked by bill clinton. outnegotiated time and time again. so these things do ma
i'm wondering if john boehner and barack obama got together, had their short conversation and say hey, why don't we characterize this as a curt, short, curt conversation. that will help you with your people. that will help -- didn't you love that? you know, we hear they talked, and they had a curt conversation. >> reporter: yeah. there is truth to that. >> exactly what both sides wanted to hear. >> reporter: no, there is truth to that. look, the white house is well aware that...